Ep. 039: Making Your Business Systems Sexy w/ Veronica Yanhs
Systems might seem really boring or tedious to set up, but taking the time to create systems in your business frees you up so you can do the work you really love. Plus, you won't feel like you're scrambling all the time.
In this episode I interview systems expert Veronica Yanhs and she explains simple ways you can set up systems for yourself to give you more freedom in your business.
BIO: Veronica is a multi-passionate entrepreneur on a mission to strip people bare—of the expectations and limiting beliefs that do not serve them—so they can thrive unapologetically exactly as they are. From systems to spankings, she emboldens womxn to leverage their pleasure and power in business and the bedroom with Business Laid Bare (systems for creatives and entrepreneurs that scale and save their sanity) and Desires Laid Bare (kink and BDSM education for beginners in a fun and shame-free way). She gets all hot and bothered by diligent process, thoughtful protocols, and high-quality service: from the spreadsheets to the bedsheets.
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Erika Tebbens: World marketing culture and sketchy MLMs have given modern business a bad reputation. It feels harder than ever to succeed as an entrepreneur, even though we've got an abundance of info and tech, right at our fingertips. If you feel frustrated, running your business, stress over your sales poles or are baffled by marketing strategies, you've come to the right place.
Erika Tebbens: You deserve to run a successful sustainable business without spamming all of your friends or wasting time and money on marketing gimmicks. This is the Sell It Sister Podcast, and you're going to learn how to make more money without complex systems or sleazy sales tactics. I'm Erika Tebbens and I teach highly motivated female and gender expansive entrepreneurs, that selling doesn't have to suck.
Erika Tebbens: I've been running successful businesses and teaching others how to sell smarter, earn more and create raving fans for over 15 years. And I'm excited to share what I've learned with you. If you want success without truly serving your clients, profits without any passion, or the next get rich quick scheme, I'm not your girl, but if you're all in as an entrepreneur, want to make a difference with your work and are ready to run a business you're proud of, then get ready to sell it, sister.
Erika Tebbens: If you find that you're struggling with sales conversations, if they stress you out, or you find that you're always stumbling over your words, or you're not closing as many sales as you like, or you just are really petrified, of coming across as that pushy salesperson, I have great news for you. I have a totally free, completely a hundred percent free, no catch, no sleaze sales method guide just for you.
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Erika Tebbens: So go ahead and make sure you download this Knowsley sales method guide. And once you go through it, it's really, really quick to go through, but if you have any questions or anything, be sure to reach out because I want to make sure that you are a selling superstar.
Erika Tebbens: This episode is going to blow your mind in multiple ways. I'm going to read Veronica's bio in just a second, but I will say that if you usually listen to these with young ears around, you might not want to. And here's why, so Veronica Yanhs is a multi-passionate entrepreneur on a mission to strip people bare, of the expectations and limiting beliefs that do not serve them, so they can thrive unapologetically exactly as they are.
Erika Tebbens: From systems to spankings, she emboldens women to leverage their pleasure and power in business and the bedroom. With business laid bare, systems for creatives and entrepreneurs that scale and save their sanity and desires laid bare, kink and BDSM education for beginners in a fun and shame-free way. She gets all hot and bothered by diligent process, thoughtful protocols, and high quality service. As she says, from the spreadsheets to the bedsheets.
Erika Tebbens: So this episode is me totally different than any other interview I've ever had. And I'm really, really excited because she gives so much value and some really mind-blowing content as well. I think that you are going to have many different types of takeaways from this episode, both practical and mindset. So, yeah, get ready. Uh, it's going to be amazing. I hope that you're here for it. I hope that you can be open-minded and nonjudgmental and listen all the way through. And as always happy selling.
Erika Tebbens: Hey, and welcome back to the podcast. I am with Veronica Yanhs and I am ridiculously excited about this interview because this one it's either going to be one that you love, or you're like, nope, time for me to go, because we are talking all about making systems sexy and other sexy stuff. We're getting hot on this episode today.
Erika Tebbens: I cannot wait, so, hey, it's so Veronica, thank you for being here. I really appreciate it, and..
Veronica Yanhs: Thank you for having me.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, and, uh, so I know, you know, everyone who's listening will have already heard me give your formal bio, but anything else you want to add before we get started? Like how you even got to the two businesses that you have.
Veronica Yanhs: So being traditionally Chinese, I was not meant to be an entrepreneur whatsoever. I was meant to be a doctor, lawyer engineer, anything with a really stable and predictable path. And of course, I did none of that. And as a kink educator, kink and BDSM educator, and I would call myself a business operations expert because operations is so wide and we'll go into that later, but it's just like these two realms have nothing to do with any of the things my parents wanted me to do.
Veronica Yanhs: And it, like my businesses, the theme of my life is about following my own path and showing up authentically, which is why. I just show up as making positive self. Everywhere I go. So here's like your warning, maybe it's time to put in earbuds. I'm not sure, but it's not that we're going to get sleazy, but want it to be respectful and put that out there.
Veronica Yanhs: Yes, yes. I mean, you know, I will say I, I swear and stuff. So every episode has like the explicit rating just in case. So, but yeah, I, uh, oh my gosh, I love it. I'm so I'm so stoked to talk about all of this and I know we are going to dive into the systems part of it first. Uh, and this is something that I find is probably, like the most challenging thing. I think that entrepreneurs have besides like being comfortable with selling and visibility. I think that systems are so hard because usually people who are entrepreneurs and which like sidebar, I think it's so rad that you took your own path and everything that you are doing your own thing and loving it and succeeding at it.
Veronica Yanhs: Uh, but I think, you know, because entrepreneurs tend to be ambitious and we tend to think like I have to do it all, I'm going to do it all. Uh, it's, everything has to kind of be a struggle in order for it to be worth it. And then systems sort of flies in the face of that. It's like, no, no, no, we're actually gonna make things easier on you and, you know, uh, make it possible for you to even like outsource somethings and, and all of that.
Veronica Yanhs: But I think that systems really is, it's like one of those things we say like, Oh, I just need better systems. But then when it comes to actually doing it, we kind of just. Stare blankly at our laptops and wonder what the hell we're supposed to do. So talk about that. Cause you are, you are such an expert. So what are like, what are systems, why do they matter and what do people need to be thinking about?
Veronica Yanhs: Okay. So just in that, like one minute of conversation, my brain is going like in 10 different directions. Cause I'm like, I have so much to say, but I will start with, yeah, I believe that systems all your best friend.
Veronica Yanhs: And if we're on a podcast that teaches you how to be visible and how to sell systems are the key to being able to sell. Because what I actually didn't know when I started my business were all the benefits that systems could give you outside of the things immediately in front of you. Like, systems give you, is like gives you more time, more money, more energy, you know, all the things that we would expect because we're operating more efficiently, we're producing and we're able to outsource because after you create a process for your systems, which we'll go into more of that.
Veronica Yanhs: But I just wanted to give an overview. I learned. And these were words that were coming out of my clients, his mouth, they were like, systems give me more confidence systems, give me more legitimacy. So the fact that I don't feel like my business under the hood, if you lift up the hood of my car, it's not a hot mess.
Veronica Yanhs: So I feel like I can be an entrepreneur. I feel like I have a place in this world to actually sell and charge my worth, or actually go for higher clients that I would have not been able to before, because I actually feel like I can do this and I have my shit together and I can, I can be that business owner that I've always envisioned. And so I had no idea that systems bread, legitimacy, confidence, and then therefore it allowed them to sell better light bulb moment.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, that is, uh, that's a really excellent point about the legitimacy, because I know that so way, way back, uh, where my sales career really got started, that was not just like in high school selling. Uh, but as, as an adult, uh, working in retail management, I worked for Calvin Klein and we had operations and systems that were non-negotiable, like we would get audited on them. And because, you know, when you're, when you're operating at a multimillion dollar store and you're leading a huge team and people are paying you a good salary to make sure that everything is running smoothly, not just, oh, you're selling a lot of stuff.
Erika Tebbens: Uh, you have to have those things in place. So we would have very strict, like. Every Monday, we would audit all the previous week's paperwork. Every Tuesday we would do all of our like shipment would, we would receive it in and prep it for the floor. Every Wednesday we would do our markdowns, like, and things just had to get done.
Erika Tebbens: But I know it's so much harder when we work for ourselves 'cause there's nobody there saying like, it's Monday, you better, you better write your list, you know, write your weekly newsletter or whatever the case may be. So, so what are some ways that people can get started figuring out like where the hell do they even begin? What do they do first? What do they need to consider? What mistakes are you seeing people making when they're trying to do this on their own?
Veronica Yanhs: Okay. So let's start with the mistakes one, because I feel like I can't say this enough. People when they ask about what, like, I see this in Facebook groups, even LinkedIn conversations.
Veronica Yanhs: What's your favorite system in your business? Someone will ask this question and you will see nonstop people just saying, trello is my favorite system or a sauna or whatever app or software out there. And I think the biggest mistake is that people think an app is a system, an app, or a software is a system and it is not a system at its most basic is a repeatable method that achieves a specific result.
Veronica Yanhs: And to me, if you wanted to create systems, wow. An app is kind of like the tip of the iceberg. It's the thing that makes your system run more efficiently and more automated. And in the 21st century, because at the heart of things, if you have a method that achieves a specific result, you should be able to do it manually, but we're not in the 17th century anymore.
Veronica Yanhs: And so that's where apps come in. They allow us to do things faster. And so, oftentimes that's where people, I think fall into that chasm is because they have to, they're trying to find, create a system to fit the app rather than make the app fit the system. And so therefore the system is already broken to begin with because you have to like customize yourself to fit something that should be the other way around.
Erika Tebbens: Mm, I love that. Cause I think too, Uh, I have seen it in a lot of people and been very, very tempted to do it myself. Uh, is the, like, how do I say this? Jumping from platform to platform, kind of like when people, uh, do a different paper planner every year, like, well, last year I didn't manage my time well, and it's, Oh, it must've been the planner's fault.
Erika Tebbens: So I'm going to get a different $50 paper planner this year and it's going to solve all my problems. And I think that I've, I've definitely seen that where it's, you know, people who are like, oh, well I'm getting a sauna now, or I'm getting a, you know, whatever this like airtable or Monday, or right. And they just keep hopping, hopping, hopping, and then having to relearn.
Erika Tebbens: And it's like, well, maybe it's,
Veronica Yanhs: It's such a waste of time. A good system strategy. So the foundational strategy, I'm not talking about the execution, but the foundational strategy should always be app agnostic. So like, if we're going to use project management as an example, because I think that's really, really easy to talk about, like at the heart of things, I, when I work with clients.
Veronica Yanhs: Okay. So put a pin in this. I got to share a little story. So my background is actually in product design and entrepreneurship. So I went to school discovered that there was the world of product design and entrepreneurship. And that's actually how I started my project management operations, like love affair.
Veronica Yanhs: I didn't know that how I thought so naturally was not how everyone else thought. And so. When I went to the product design classes and stuff, they'd have us do all these projects, right. Build this thing, or come up with a design solution for this problem. And I realized that a lot of creative people couldn't execute on their ideas.
Veronica Yanhs: My classmates had brilliant ideas, don't get me wrong, but they just couldn't get beyond that. And so that's where I came in and that's how I realized that systems because of my training in product design. Creating systems, well, requires a lot of compassion and empathy, and also alignment because Stanford.
Veronica Yanhs: So I went to Stanford and this, they had this theory called human centered design. It's like, you're designing for this person. You have to know this person so well, so that when you design for them, they will find it orgasmic, which is why I think your operations should also be orgasmic. Caveat Stanford didn't use the word orgasmic.
Veronica Yanhs: If your operations or your systems, aren't orgasmic, you, won't be excited to use them. And the only way there'll be a orgasmic to you is if you create systems that align with how you think, where you want to go in your business and also how you work. So if you are a very visual person with sticky notes and whiteboards, you might not do so well with a project management platform to execute your productivity system in the list view, right?
Veronica Yanhs: You might benefit from something like Trello, where it's very, very visual and you can move things around. So it's like the electronic version of what you could do in your office on a whiteboard, but now in the cloud so that you and your team can do it too.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. And I, I will say that is one reason, yeah. That's one reason why I, I love Trello because I am, I am a super visual person in that, in that aspect. So it just, I don't know, it works, it works very well for me. Uh, and, uh, and I, yeah, my VA and I also, we have our own board and it's such a, it makes it so simple to communicate with each other. I love it.
Veronica Yanhs: And the moment that creatives or creative entrepreneurs hear the word systems, they like freak out because they think it's so ugly and corporate sounding, but it's like, if you think about it as a tool to help you be more creative or more free, because freedom is my number one core value. And so the more systems I have, the more freedom I can experience in my business and in my life.
Veronica Yanhs: It's like start to just sit with yourself. And I know this sounds really boring, but like journal, journal, how will you think, how you approach problems? Are you a night owl? Do you like to work with noise or do you need it completely silent? And I know it doesn't really have anything to do with systems, but it's about knowing you as a person, because then you start to have epiphanies about how you can create a system.
Veronica Yanhs: So the number one thing that I start with when I create a system for a client or just myself, is, I discover who I am. It's not jumping straight into the app or what I need. It's like, who am I as a person? And so like, if a person like you, Eric had needed a system and you were more inclined to like chocolate things. Of course, I'm going to create a solution that has chocolate in it and not like Apple because you wanted chocolate. But if I was to create a system that had Apple flavored things, you'd be like, no, I don't like the system. This is stupid because I like chocolate. Right? So it's about knowing what you need so you can set yourself up for success.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. I agree.
Veronica Yanhs: We'll move fuzzy designed things, but that's how I approach operations.
Erika Tebbens: No, and I, I think it's good. It's how, it's how I approach my business now, because in previous businesses, I was just very much like head down. We're just going to hustle. And, uh, I had a lot of success, but I also had a lot of burnout and I've had to really relearn, like, who am I, how do I want to work? How do I want to show up? What, like, when am I the most productive and what tasks do I want to be working on in those times? And, uh, it's really transformed how I set up my, my work weeks, but I'm sure there are probably things that I could systematize better.
Erika Tebbens: So what are some other things that you walk people through or examples of like a really common way? That you would set up systems for like online entrepreneurs, especially.
Veronica Yanhs: I think the biggest one, especially because we're so easily distracted nowadays is I look at the group of productivity, right? So I like to create systems that help my clients be more productive because this is how they make money.
Veronica Yanhs: Right? The more productive you are, the more that you're doing things that a CEO like you was supposed to do and not being an employee for your own business, you're able to show up, be more visible. So, and not hide behind your computer and spend like all day working on your website. I've done that before, but that was because I was afraid to show up and do the things that mattered.
Veronica Yanhs: So to get people out of that admin, a minute, oh my goodness, I can't english today, admin assistant type of tasks, I have three categories. They're either systems that create income, impact, or internal. So to me, impact is things that get you visible, right? What type of things could you be doing to systematize your business that help you show up more easily?
Veronica Yanhs: And then of course, income is pretty obvious. It's how do you, you know, how do you systematize something that helps make you money now directly or in the future? And generally the more you show up, the more impact type systems you have, the more income you have. And then my very last one is about creating systems in the internals of your business.
Veronica Yanhs: Basically systems that help your business run more efficiently because of you're more efficient and you're more productive. You have more time to have impact, which then leads to more income at the end. So they all tie together really nicely. So my favorite thing is just to ask people, it's like, What is your goal right now?
Veronica Yanhs: Like what is, or maybe what is it? That's a pain in your ass, usually a pain in your ass is the easiest one to talk about. Like, I'll have a client say, I hate thinking about what to write every week for my email newsletter. So I'm like, oh, okay. So we're going to talk about impact. So have you considered maybe batch.
Veronica Yanhs: Working all eight weeks worth of emails in like a one week period. So back to working as a great productivity systems for the internals of your business, because you're more efficient and you're more able to consistently show up because if you batch create two months worth, so for eight weeks worth of emails, all you have to do is just like schedule them.
Veronica Yanhs: And it's already done. You don't have to figure out like on Monday morning, holy crap. What the hell am I going to write?
Erika Tebbens: Yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: When you're in the flow and you're not context switching and you're focused on one thing, you can get a lot more done, more efficiently. So that's productivity and efficiency together.
Erika Tebbens: That is so good. And I, so I love batching. I'm a huge proponent of batching. And as I write now and planning out content for 2020, uh, one thing that trips me up every week. So now that I have the podcast comes out every Wednesday, it's a very natural thing that I can have an email that also goes out on Wednesday.
Erika Tebbens: That's like, hey, here's the new episode. And here's what we're talking about. And give a little taste and then direct them right to it if they want to listen. And that is something that is really like, that is a simple system, but one thing I hadn't considered what, because I batch my podcasts. So it's, and so I usually know, I would say at least the next four to six weeks, what is coming out, but I, it never occurred to me that I could just pick one day and sit down and write for six emails and just have them done and ready to go.
Veronica Yanhs: Yeah. I mean, just imagine how awesome you'd feel because when you get into the flow. And so to me, like when you're in alignment, so that's like effortless consistency. You know, whatever's going to come out is going to be so much more amazing than if you were to like, rush and feel like, Oh my gosh, I have to do this.
Veronica Yanhs: So when you give yourself the freedom to just write within like a set amount of time. So I called that structured freedom. You're able to get so much more done. So I, I don't know if I have ever done a study of this personally, but I've always wanted to like say, Hey client, do this once a week, everything that you're supposed to do every week, like social media or whatever it is, do it once a week.
Veronica Yanhs: And then compare that to what happens if you did a whole month's worth of social media content in one day, how long did it take you to do it on one day versus like the total cumulative of time over the month? So it would just be curious for me to do a study on that myself, because I totally believe have you're so focused and not context switching. You're just getting to be that much more efficient.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, I agree. And when I get, when, when I'm like on it, when I'm doing it, it's so wonderful. And when I get off of the schedule, I'm like, oh my gosh, it's, it feels like a lot of playing catch up and being more like reactive in my days, rather than proactive in my days.
Veronica Yanhs: Uh, yeah. So basically just find a way to come towards systems. So approach systems with like a mindset shift. So the moment creatives here, systems, they're like, ew, gross, rigidity, which if systems are rigid, that's not a good system in my opinion, my humble opinion, because we're multifaceted ever evolving creatures.
Veronica Yanhs: So therefore our systems should be the same because we're creating systems for ourselves. And so again, if it doesn't feel our guests make it, we're not excited if we're not aligned with it, it's not going to work out. So you can't see me on video obviously, but I'm like doing this interpretive dance that Eric gets so much, we do.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. A very, like being very flexible and very free. I love that. So are when it comes to the income part of it. So obviously if yes, if someone is batching all of their blog posts or podcasts and then their weekly newsletters and all of that, they are going to be more consistently visible. And then what are some ways that you've set up systems for people on the income side of things?
Veronica Yanhs: There's so many. Okay. So I'm like, I have clients who are makers, clients who are online entrepreneurs. Um, I think the one that shows up the most consistently is just a system that allows clients to either buy. So I'm trying to like pull out as much as I can, because I want to speak to a wider audience.
Veronica Yanhs: It's about creating a repeatable system that you don't have to necessarily touch that allows you to make money easier. So an example from the service based side, so if you run a social media agency or if you're a virtual assistant or whatever it is, it's like, how do we make it easy for clients to book a call with you?
Veronica Yanhs: And therefore when the sales call is over, how can we make it easy for them to pay you, sign the contract and all that stuff? Because a lot of clients nowadays are still sending emails back and forth saying, what time is good for you? Hey, I'm in this time zone, what's your time zone? It's like the simplest thing, like signing up for a scheduling app, like acuity, calendar Lee, and all that stuff.
Veronica Yanhs: And having them schedule themselves into your calendar. As basic as it might sound for somebody listening. It's like, mind-blowing for another person, but it's just like, how can we minimize the amount of ways that you need to actually interact or touch your business to get paid? And I know it sounds really, really out there, but that's why I'm trying to, like, I'm trying to take it up to the 10,000 foot level.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, and, uh, I know like over the summer, uh, last summer I had a woman I know she redid all my branding and my website and it was so great because once we had our call and we were going to start working together, she just sent me the one link to her dub Sato, and it took me through everything, signing the contract, and getting the payment schedule set up. And I was like, oh, this is awesome, I love this.
Veronica Yanhs: Yeah, because I cannot, I can't count the amount of times that I've had clients tell me that they have forgotten to invoice their clients, their clients. And I'm like, What do you mean? They're like, yeah, I'm out like $3,000 because I just realized that all that stuff got buried in my email.
Veronica Yanhs: I'm like, okay, see, how can we now systematize your workflow to make it so that you get paid and you get your money easier without you pulling out your hair. So it's, so the whole income impact, internal things, they all kind of just play together because, to generate that income you're making your business also run more efficiently.
Veronica Yanhs: Right? So it's like, it's not necessarily, like there are systems within each category, but it's just like keeping that mindset of understanding how can I systematize my business to generate more money easily? Or how can I, because I hate showing up on social media and I never know what to say on Instagram.
Veronica Yanhs: How can I just get it done so that I can show up more consistently? So it's like, they all are interconnected together because I don't ever think that systems are black and white. There's a lot of gray. I just almost throw out like a 50 shades of gray. Like, how many shades of gray? Maybe 50.
Erika Tebbens: There might be 50 shades of gray here.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. I, uh, I agree. Oh, I love it. I can't wait to talk about the next part of this, but yeah, no, that's, that is all like, even for me, um, that has all been super helpful. And I can say I don't, I don't yet use like a dub Sato or a HoneyBook or anything like that quite yet. But I do use acuity for booking of calls and it's amazing.
Erika Tebbens: Like, it is just an I, right at the beginning of every month or just before every month I go in, I block out the whole month and it's just like, Oh, it's a weight has been lifted. Now I can just send people a link, and it's done, so great.
Veronica Yanhs: And the reason why you love it so much is because it achieves a very specific result that you would have otherwise had to do manually. And so you happen to find the perfect app that does everything that you would have done manually in your business, if would be, which is what I used to didn't exist. Shout out acuity.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, I know. Sponsor us man.
Veronica Yanhs: And decided to, and clicker.
Erika Tebbens: Oh, I just recently learned about clicker, but I haven't used it yet.
Veronica Yanhs: Oh my God. It's like air table dubs, um not dub Sato. I can't English. It's like air table Trello and a stunner had the perfect love child.
Erika Tebbens: Ooh..
Veronica Yanhs: I know. I love it.
Erika Tebbens: I'm gonna have to look into that.
Veronica Yanhs: I'll give you like a little run through and show you how I set things up, because you can view it as like a list view, or you can view it like a Trello view, or you can even view it on a Gantt chart view because I love Gantt charts.
Erika Tebbens: Nice.
Veronica Yanhs: I Gantt chart with my wedding, by the way.
Erika Tebbens: You, what? What is it?
Veronica Yanhs: I gantt charted my wedding.
Erika Tebbens: Oh, nice.
Veronica Yanhs: So no bridezilla. Everything was done on time and pretty much okay. Confession after I gantt charted my wedding, I was like, okay, I don't need to have the wedding anymore. I fulfilled them. I need to get married my Gantt chart. So that's just how much I think about things, it's very much a linear thinking. So like, step one, step two, step three.
Veronica Yanhs: But the way that I receive information is very like chaotic. But it's like, I take all that chaos and I distill it into repeatable and actionable steps because I think at the heart of things that goes back to my days in college, it's like, yeah, being innovative is awesome, but you know, what's even better being innovative on repeat.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: Make it easy for yourself to be innovative. If you have the right infrastructure in place to support that creativity.
Erika Tebbens: I like that. And what would you say, like, I know you talked a lot about freedom and stuff, but what would you say to people who have more of a rebellious streak where they're like, well, I just like to create content when I'm moved or, um, you know, I don't know all of, all of those things cause I'm somebody like, I'm, I'm weird.
Erika Tebbens: Like I'm an obliger and I love planning and, and all of that, but then I also have this really stubborn streak and sometimes I'm just like, uh, oh, I don't want to kind of, but I know it doesn't serve me, but it's just, I feel like it's my ego throwing a tantrum to be like, yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: And that's exactly what I would say to those people. And don't get me wrong. I. As much as I love being tied up in rope or whatever, I don't like being tied down or at the mercy of my business. Like I don't like it when my business runs me. And so when people tell me like, Oh, I'm just not meant to be a systematized, I'm a free spirit. And I'm like, okay, well, I see potential in you.
Veronica Yanhs: And unfortunately you're free spirited, this can only happen if you're like, I dunno, Marie Forleo or Elon Musk, like caliber, where you have a team of people doing the things that you don't want to do, because if you're inconsistent or if you're showing up whenever you are, it's like you're running a business, not an inexpensive hobby.
Veronica Yanhs: And so when people were like, I'm the free spirited person that goes with the wind. It's like, well, there's going to have to be some discipline in place where maybe you're not meant to be an entrepreneur. So find ways to compromise. How can you be free spirited, but also structured to actually move your business forward?
Veronica Yanhs: And a lot of that free spiritedness sometimes can actually be expressed by giving yourself an entire day to do something so like makers. I love having clients as makers because. Makers as clients, my goodness. I think we need like a ding for every time I can put like English, but it's like makers just want to make right.
Veronica Yanhs: And they're not so good at systems because this is not how they think, and it's not natural, but it's like, hey client, what if I gave you two whole days to just make your Tuesdays and Wednesdays? And all you have to do is just play and make and do things for two whole day. That's all you have to worry about.
Veronica Yanhs: That totally satisfies their need to be free because she's like, not only am I able to create amazing product, I have all day to do it. I don't feel pressured. And the inspiration just flows. I don't have to think about anything else because we worked out a productivity system to plan out her week in like really, really like structured, but not too rigid way that allowed her to say, okay, on Fridays, she has to do her admin or whatever meetings that she may have, but the biggest non-negotiables that we set first were the two days that she wanted to create. And then we worked around that. So there are ways to get creative and it's like, how much do you really want to run a successful business? Because you don't have to bite the bullet and have some sort of discipline, but it doesn't mean you have to do it like anybody else just make it fit your life.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, I think that's a, that's a really great point. Is that like, we do have the flexibility to do the work more or less when we want to do it, but it's non-negotiable it has to be done. So, yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: Or if you're not the free flowy type, so here comes the marketing system for you, it's called for me, it's like you're creating scheduled content or you're creating spontaneous content and scheduled content is basically you're pre-writing things and scheduling them. And then it also leaves room for you to be spontaneous, because if you also feel like inspired one moment, even though you have something already scheduled, it's like you can easily move the thing that you schedule to the next couple of weeks or the next week over and slot in something that you wrote Sunday night to go out Monday morning.
Veronica Yanhs: Right. So, yeah. There are ways to satisfy that need to be creative and rebellious. But at the end of the day, it's like, how much do you want to run a business? Because the business requires discipline to some extent.
Erika Tebbens: Yes, I, yeah. It a hundred percent does. And that is, I feel like that's the most, um, like unglamorous part of it, because when you're just sitting alone in your house at your desk, it's just so it's so unsexy, but it's the discipline of, you know, doing those things to get the result that you ultimately want in your business.
Veronica Yanhs: I think that's just part of discovering who you are too. If you know, for a fact that you are free-spirited. It's like, how can you integrate that into your, into your life, into your business? Right? Because your business is very much who you are. It should never be your baby. It should be a full functioning, independent adult. So that's a pet peeve when people are like, my business is my baby. And like, you don't want that.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. Baby, babies are a lot of work. Yeah. A lot of work.
Veronica Yanhs: Even though I have, my baby is four legged and furry, I understand the metaphor. So it's just like, how can we satisfy your need? Because I would hate to never give you that need, like, if you needed something and that's who you are.
Veronica Yanhs: And I purposely created systems that were the, the exact opposite, then I'm not doing my job well, because that would mean that I didn't understand you well enough. So the onus is on you to make sure that you understand who you are and create. Some sort of an ecosystem to fit your needs.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, I would say too yet that's extremely crucial. I love that. So I, that was all like, I know you have other stuff, actually. I will just have you. Pitch it now, before we get to the next part, cause you have some really cool stuff that you have available to people. I know you work one-on-one with people as well, but why don't you talk a little bit about other ways that people can get systems help before we switch gears?
Veronica Yanhs: Okay. Can I actually pitch two things then?
Erika Tebbens: Absolutely.
Veronica Yanhs: Because I feel like so much about productivity. So I put on a monthly productivity workshop, basically I help you plan and execute your next 90 days of projects in a way that helps your business makes money, make money because without sales, what are we doing? Right.
Veronica Yanhs: So I have that. So I'll give you the link for my monthly workshop. I don't know when my next one is, but by the time this airs, hopefully I'll have gotten my shit together and figured that out. But I love helping people plan that out because the worst thing that can happen, and I've experienced this so much is you feel like you're working like so hard, right?
Veronica Yanhs: You're like, Oh my God, I'm working grinding 10 hours a day, whatever it is. And then you look back and you're like, I actually don't really know if I have anything to show for it.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: Right. So my goal is to get rid of all of that and to actually help you do and plan meaningful projects that lead to sales, visibility, places that you want to go, whatever it is that you want in the next 90 days. And then we run it in 90 day blocks because 13 weeks, third quarter is like the best time frame for motivation and momentum. It's like you have enough time to actually see results, like, and then we break those things down into like two weeks sprint projects. So like you're literally sprinting to get your project done.
Veronica Yanhs: And you'd be surprised as to how much you can get done in two weeks. Like I found 122 podcasts to pitch to in two weeks.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: Right. It's like, I wouldn't have been able to do that if I did like a little bit of a day out a day, it's like, I totally just gave myself two weeks. Like this was my sprint project and I'm just going to do it. And I was able to focus and just, that was the only thing I was doing. Before I did like client work and stuff.
Erika Tebbens: I love that. Yeah, because I, I do mine in 90 days as well. Cause I feel like beyond that, it's really hard for me to conceptualize, what will be going on. And, uh, I mean, certain things like I can plunk down like, oh, you know, I know that we're going to have enrollment for this program or whatever, but when it comes to the day to day, my brain really only can work in in the 90 day chunks.
Veronica Yanhs: Yeah. And it also accounts for how much your life can change in an instant it's giving the universe. So I believe in the universe, it's giving the universe the chance to work for you because. If you're constantly planning like your year, I feel like you're leaving a lot of room out for amazingness that would have never else happened.
Erika Tebbens: No, I agree. And what's the other one.
Veronica Yanhs: Okay. So my other one is. Something that's very, very near and dear to my heart. So it's my love child, it's called scattered to streamlined. It's my comprehensive program that helps you get your business out of your head and into repeatable and efficient systems so that you can have the clarity and focus to generate more sales.
Veronica Yanhs: So essentially I'm teaching you how to create systems in your business with pretty much done for you templates, with systems that I've created for myself and my clients backed out in a way that's customizable to fit your needs, whether you're a service based business, a maker, or in online like digital product.
Erika Tebbens: Nice. That is really cool. And that sounds, insanely valuable, just phenomenally like ridiculously good, a good thing to have.
Veronica Yanhs: Because that's like the biggest problem. So people tell me they don't know how to create systems. They're afraid that if they created it's not good enough. So that a second guessing is just killer and third, they don't have time, which if you don't have time to create systems in your business, What are you doing?
Veronica Yanhs: Because systems are like the heart of your business. And if your heart is not pumping efficiently on its own, and you have to constantly like play with it, imagine how much life and opportunity and business goes by that you missed out on. So it's like a roadmap that teaches people how to systematize plus the given template.
Veronica Yanhs: So it's already like done for you. So you have no excuse not to do it.
Erika Tebbens: Yes.
Veronica Yanhs: In a way that's easy and digestible to understand.
Erika Tebbens: Exactly, exactly. Well, so that was all super, super great. And I hope that, you know, if you're listening and you are struggling with this system, definitely reach out to Veronica, for sure.
Erika Tebbens: Uh, and now as we pivot, I, this was actually when you pitched to me, so for listeners, I know Veronica now, she was actually the first person to ever pitch me to be a guest on the podcast. Yeah. And so through that, then, I began to like, know you, I, we started, uh, interacting and chatting online and then I've met.
Erika Tebbens: Other people through you who are amazing business, bad asses. And at first I was like, okay. So she is like in the kink and BDSM, and she has this other business that is, uh, centers around that. And I was like, how was that gonna line up with my audience? And then I was like, wait, it perfectly aligns with what I teach, which is that.
Erika Tebbens: Authenticity sells and that you need to attract the best for you and repel the rest. And I'm like, what, what greater example of this is somebody who is very openly in a subculture that a lot of people have a lot of big judgy opinions on, and you're like, I don't care. This is who I am and I'm open and I'm honest about it.
Erika Tebbens: And if you can look beyond it or you think it's super rad, like, great. Let's do the thing, but if you're super offended, like goodbye, you can go find another systems person and to really own that and be comfortable with that, I think is so hard for a lot of entrepreneurs because we, like, we just want to be liked by everyone.
Veronica Yanhs: I know. And it was like the first piece of advice I ever received from a mentor years back was they were like, be very moderate so that you don't offend anybody. And then, but this was like in 2012. And I'm noticing that when I find my people, like I wrote them in and I never let them go well until they consent.
Veronica Yanhs: Otherwise, it's like, I love you. And I've always wanted to be around sex-positive women who you don't have to be like crazy kinky like me, but just people who love to talk about sex-positive related things, or they like to drop sex-positive related kink. Uh, puns. And so it's like, I just wanted to be around ambitious sex-positive people.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: And this is the community that I created because people that love me, they're like, like I kid you not, this is what someone typed in an instant message to me on Facebook. I am running with you. And to you with my tits, bouncing as high as they can, because that's how fast I'm trying to run without wearing a bra.
Veronica Yanhs: I'm like, you are my person because I am not wearing a bra and I love it. And so it's like, this is the culture that I've created because it allows women. So most of the people that I am surrounded with are women identified female identified, but it's giving them the permission to just talk about topics that they've always wondered about.
Veronica Yanhs: Like nothing is a conversation starter, then when I tell my kink origin story, Right. I just think because of Disney, I watched Aladdin and I'm like, I don't want to be this blue Jasmine with the flying carpet and the tiger. I want it to be the red Jasmine, the one that's captured by Jafar, shackled and thrown in the hourglass. I love it.
Erika Tebbens: I wait. So how and how old were you when you were watching that for? I love it. So you're holding.
Veronica Yanhs: Well I didn't know at the time with that is like, that what, that was, it was like, you know, when you're four, what do you know? But it's like, I was just curious as to what my kink origin story was. And I'm just like, I think I was born kinky or rather if it's nurture or nature or whatever.
Veronica Yanhs: And if there's something wrong with me, I go see a therapist anyway. So I'm adult enough to be able to have this conversation if I need that. But it's like, kink has allowed me to not only find my voice in how I communicate, but it's like the way that I saw or the way that I show up. It's like, you're right.
Veronica Yanhs: I'm not the only person in the ops world or in the systems world, but it's just like, if you want systems with my flavor to it, you know, that's why people come to me because it's like, yes, the empathy and the human design centered part, but it's also about being empowered. And are emboldened or giving people permission to just show up and thrive authentically because that's what the laid bare brand is about.
Veronica Yanhs: It's like stripping away the shit that doesn't serve you, like limiting beliefs, other people's beliefs expectations so that you can thrive. They're exactly as you are, because if you don't know who you are, because everyone else's opinions have like covered you in ugly sweaters. It's like, how are you going to show up in the world as yourself?
Erika Tebbens: Yeah.
Veronica Yanhs: And so that resonates with a lot of people. And that's like my why of why I get up every day is because it's like, this is freedom to show up exactly as I meant to be and show up unapologetically.
Erika Tebbens: That is so cool and so powerful. And I think something that now more than ever, I, I feel really called to sort of like practice and preach that myself because yeah, I feel like we, we live in a time now where we can be more visible than ever and really attract those perfect fit clients.
Erika Tebbens: And we can be really, you know, open and honest about, about who we are. And, and obviously for, for certain people like sadly it's, you know, uh, I feel like in a lot of ways we should be more advanced and more, uh, inclusive and supportive and affirming and, and all of those things. Uh, hopefully we are still going in a, in a more progressive direction with that.
Erika Tebbens: But I do think that we, we live in a time where there is a lot of choice and a lot of options and people can find the exact person that they want to give their money to and work with. And like you said, like not all of your clients are into BDSM and kink, but they appreciate your honesty and that you being bold allows them that permission to be bold themselves in the way that serves them, which I think is really awesome.
Veronica Yanhs: And one of my very first clients that came to me when I started showing up. This way was somebody who works for a church. So she runs social media for her church group. And I was just like, I'm curious, you know, why me given this? And she's like, because this is how God created you. And so I love you because he created you this way. And I'm like where can I find more of this person? Cause usually religion leaves a sour taste in my mouth because I've been surrounded by a lot of people who have tried to convert me or shame me in the past. So it's like when you show up, if somebody who is kinky, like me can have such a wonderful relationship with a client who is Christian, who was like Christian and focused on family and God, I mean, I think that speaks for something.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah, that's really rad, but yeah, I love that, she, I love it that was her outlook on it. That's really refreshing.
Veronica Yanhs: I know. Right. So I never have forgotten that. And it's just a reminder that if somebody like me can do it. You can do it too. And we can all do it. We can just show up individually together because the more we show up as ourselves, the more we give other people that permission to do the same and rise up.
Erika Tebbens: I agree. And it has been my lived experience, like more times than I could even say, which is always weird to me because in my head I'm like still 15 and like super nerdy, like nerdy, punk rock, uh, girl, and like thrift store clothes.
Erika Tebbens: And I mean, in my core, I am still that person, uh, but, you know, I was never, I have never been somebody who was like a popular kid or, or anything like that. And so I feel like I always flew under the radar in a lot of ways. And in the last few years, I've, I've done a few things that other people are like, wow, I'm really amazed that you did that. Or I don't know. They'll just say really lovely, complimentary things to me. Um, like on Facebook or whatever, just might not even business friends, just like friends.
Veronica Yanhs: Right.
Erika Tebbens: They're like, you know, you really inspire me and I'm like, what me? Like, I, don't even say that that's not even like a humble brag or anything.
Erika Tebbens: I'm honestly just shocked every time. And, and they're like, you know, or when people say, oh, because of you, I did, you know, I whatever, like change jobs or do this thing. And I'm like, are you freaking kidding me? Like I would, I think that we, like what, my point of all of that is to say, like, we have a greater impact on other people's lives than I think that any of us realize just by doing things that are a little bit scary, but we do them anyways. I think, like I said, it, it allows other people to go, well, she can do that and nothing terrible happened. And maybe I can do this thing that I want to do as well.
Veronica Yanhs: It's so interesting. Cause you would think that I would get so much backlash or hate because I'm like naked on my homepage or wherever you might see me.
Veronica Yanhs: And it's like, I haven't really gotten any, because I think I just show up in a way that is authentic to me, I'm more, you know, I don't consider myself sexy, but it's like I'm cutesy and adorable and fun. And so that's just how I view kink as well. And so maybe it's that same flavor and my personality that allows people to feel safe because I have never thought about this, but so many women, especially my clients end up asking me about kink.
Veronica Yanhs: They're like Veronica, you're portrayal of what it means to be submissive. So I am in a dominant submissive relationship with my partner. I am on the S side of the slash so I'm actually a slave, but for the ease of conversation, I'm just like a sub. And they're like, you are this ambitious entrepreneur who wants to make seven figures and beyond. And you're so powerful and stubborn. How is it that you can submit? And I'm like, cause that's the definition of feminism. It's like the freedom to choose my own path. I'm choosing to be a CEO. I'm choosing to be a feminist. I'm choosing to be a submissive.
Veronica Yanhs: And I have a partner that wants me to shoot for the moon, right? So it's all it's myself, but it's also because I'm inviting people into my life that align with me so well, because it's like, I don't want to settle, right? If it's not orgasmic, I tell people then don't settle. And, uh, same thing with life systems.
Veronica Yanhs: It's like, if your systems are not orgasmic, don't settle. Figure out why they're not orgasmic and make them fit you, right? If your life is not orgasmic, it's like, how can you show up? Or how can you fulfill a part of you that makes you, makes you smile, makes you have joy. And so that's just the philosophy that I live by, which is what it means to be laid there at the end of the day for me.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. And in a second, I want you to talk more about your desires laid bare business, but I'm sure, like I'm curious and I'm sure people listening are curious, how did you go from four year old who was like, I like this, but I don't even know what this is to actually finding out about that because I think that for a lot of people. It's that thing of like, it's almost like when you're a grown up and you're like, but where do I buy weed? You know, like I can't ask Kathy and accounting for, you know, like, you know what I mean? It's like, I think it's a thing where people go, I know it's out there, but like, like where and how do I learn about it and not have to be subjected to like, creeps on the internet, you know, it was, I think that's what people think.
Veronica Yanhs: And then that's how I created it is laid bare for, to be that resource that I really wanted when I first discovered kink outside of my toddlerhood. So it went from Aladdin and the next phase is actually Star Wars because you know, when Leia gets captured by Jabba the Hutt, you rewind the tape until it burns out.
Veronica Yanhs: I remember those days, but it's just like, Oh my God, I want this. And so I just kept discovering things. And the next thing was secretary with Maggie Gyllenhaal, chillin on James Spader, that's such a good film.
Erika Tebbens: Oh my God, it's so good.
Veronica Yanhs: Thank you very much. And then of course, the one that really resonated with me was this Harry Potter fan fiction that I read in college when I was procrastinating on my paper. And it basically portrayed Hermione's life as a submissive. She had no idea she was submissive. And so the romantic storyline was her inside of her snake because they are my ones repairing. So this is my Harry Potter coming out. And I was like, here is the stubbornness fuck powerful bad-ass witch. And she wants to be submissive to somebody really, really smart.
Veronica Yanhs: It resonated with me like no other. And so that was like, okay, so I can have this. I can be smart. And just because I'm submissive doesn't mean I'm a doormat. I can do this. So this is how I discovered kink ones, because I started typing in things on the internet. And then I found the Facebook of kink, which is @life.com and approach it.
Veronica Yanhs: When you sign up for FetLife, don't use it as a dating site. You use it to find events. Locally to you so that you can meet your local community members in person. Cause that's what I did. I went to my first munch, which is basically a kinky meet up. You wear regular clothes, people go in after work, but it's also met at a bar or a restaurant, which is why it's called the munch because there's food.
Veronica Yanhs: And so that's how I went into the kink community. It was like, I met people, introvert, Veronica almost turned around, but I didn't, I met people, who were genuine, who were welcoming. And that's how I started being a member in the community is because I took it offline and actually immersed myself that way.
Erika Tebbens: That's really cool. I, and I, I think that there's a lot of parallel to that with business as well. I think a lot of people online entrepreneurs forget there's a whole world of networking and meetups and conferences and in-person things which are really powerful. It's it's, you know, online communities are great, but it is really powerful to meet people in person too. That's great.
Veronica Yanhs: I wouldn't have been able to run desires laid bare and business laid bare together if it weren't for systems. So it's like, I'm not necessarily working harder. I'm just working smarter, but smart work is hard work because it's not easy to think differently. So it's like, I do a lot of batching. I do a lot of pre-planning. And so most of what I talked about today in this episode, it's like things that I do for myself and I do each business at a time in a way that makes sense. And so even though business laid bare makes more money now it's like, I see the validity of desires laid bare. It's just the nurture sequence for something so taboo is a lot longer than an entrepreneur. Who's like my business is a hot mess. I want to grow, but I can't here's money, right? It's a different culture. So it's like sometimes I focus 90% of my time on business laid bare and 10% on desires laid bare, and that's okay. Because it ebbs and flows.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. And for anyone who like, who are the right people for, let's say like desires laid bare. Like if somebody is listening to this right now and they're like, Oh, I'm a little curious, but I don't like, I don't know. What would you say to them about that? Obviously they can go and check out your website and do all of that, but like, who are really great, clients that you have, who've gotten the most out of what you offer over there.
Veronica Yanhs: I think it's people who respect themselves, like people who are genuinely curious about exploring the kink world and talk about niching down. So there's kink and then there's BDSM, which stands for bondage and discipline dominance and submission submission and sadism and masochism. So it's like playing of all four letters.
Veronica Yanhs: And my, actually my focus is on dominance and submission. So it's like when they say the riches are in the niches, it's actually true even in the kink world. So, desires laid there is BDSM for beginners. However, we have a huge emphasis on dominance and submission because that's what a lot of people want.
Veronica Yanhs: And that's how I'm often found on my YouTube channel. So you look at the analytics and it's like 90% of the people want dominance and submission related content. And then I'll have like my toy reviews or whatnot, but it's just like the right people for this business are people who are open-minded ambitious would be great.
Veronica Yanhs: People who are excited and just have an open mind about like, wanting to explore kink the way that they want to, right? There's no one true way. There's like one you way just like system. So there's very much a lot of parallels between two businesses.
Erika Tebbens: Yeah. And I think that it's also, uh, I think like everyone, even if somebody is not interested in learning about kink, like, I, I really strongly advise people to go and check out that site of yours.
Erika Tebbens: Like how you set it up with your branding and your business laid bare and, and all of that and your Instagram content, and like, just really see how you show up online. Because I love that you said, like you've never really gotten a ton of backlash because I think that we, a lot of times we are afraid of saying and doing a lot.
Erika Tebbens: Lot less than, uh, like you said, being naked in your headshot, just FYI. It's not like full frontal. Uh, I mean, if people are listening to this, they're seeing her head your headshot on the cover art and stuff. But, um, but I think it, yeah. Yeah. It's but it's a, I think it's a great, it's a great example of like, wow, if she, if she can show up in this way, and doesn't get a lot of backlash and has gotten amazing clients in the process, like it's okay for me to be me. However, that is and show up online as well.
Veronica Yanhs: Like when I tell people Happy Thanksgiving in the U S and may you be stuffed in all the ways that bring you joy? I mean, people can see that's not sleazy. I mean, that's literally how I speak to people. So I'm like, take it however you well, but I intended to be stuffed with food because food is my fetish, but if you take it sexually great, if you don't whatever, but that's just how I communicate. And it seems to resonate well with people because it's just me. So that's how I sell it.
Veronica Yanhs: I love it. It's so great. And what's the other thing, uh, like you, you have so many great little things, like from the, from the bedsheets to the spreadsheets. And what did you say from, uh, like pervertives to post-it notes, so we were chatting.
Veronica Yanhs: Yeah. From pervertibles to post-it notes, from spankings to sharpies. Like these are the things that make me scream with joy. Like, I love these two sides of me and I could never give any of them up because they are so integral to my identity, both the ops side and the kink side. So that's why I'm like from pervertibles to which if you don't want the, if you don't know what those are looking up, cause I don't want to tell you, cause it'd be fun for you to look it up, but it's like, it's just who I am so, yeah, that's me.
Erika Tebbens: I love it, awesome. Well, thank you so much for your time and all your knowledge and everything. This was such a cool, cool interview. And I'm so glad that you pitched to me. And now that we've become online business friends too, because I love all of the things that you do, I think it's really nice. Thank you
Veronica Yanhs: Thank you, likewise. And I can't wait to like, sit next to you in an airplane, so when we go somewhere, we each wear our awesome t-shirts. Cause that's a post that I remembered that you had. Cause I'm like, you are my person. Like I was like, hey, what about this t-shirt that I'm wearing that says glass still does not ceilings.
Erika Tebbens: Oh, yes. I love that. Oh, I love it. Yes, let's do it. Let's take a trip somewhere and really cool shirts and just freak people out. I'll wear something about murder and you wear something about kink, it'll be great.
Veronica Yanhs: Perfect. Thank you.
Erika Tebbens: Thank you. Bye Veronica.
Veronica Yanhs: Bye.
Erika Tebbens: Thanks so much for tuning in to this episode of the, Sell It Sister Podcast. If you loved it and you want more, be sure to subscribe so that you never miss an episode and then head on over to sell it.
Erika Tebbens: Sisterhood.com to join my free Facebook community group. And as your mama said, sharing is caring. So if you got a lot of value out of this episode, be sure to share it with your biz besties too, okay? Now get out there and sell it, sister.
